Gateshead - released with Northumberland, rather than Durham
Just to let you know that although Gateshead is in the county of Durham in 1911, for the purposes of the census it was enumerated and collected as part of Northumberland.
Hence records covering this area will be released with Northumberland records.
UPDATE (24/03): we have investigated this anomaly and it seems that the root of the problem is an error in the TNA data catalogue, which has now been addressed and corrected. Gateshead data will now appear when the Northumberland data is loaded in a few weeks’ time but will be searchable under the county of Durham, as it should be. Thanks for your patience!
Tags: durham, gateshead, northumberland
March 18th, 2009 at 3:24 pm
Thanks for clarfying that for everyone. Do you have any idea when Northumberland will be available? Weeks?
March 18th, 2009 at 3:49 pm
When Gateshead District does appear will it be in Northumberland or Durham……given that it has never been in Northumberland and the addresses would have been Gateshead, County Durham.
A transcription should be accurate but this would be very confusing. Someone could be born in Gateshead, Co Durham but live in Gateshead, Northumberland.
March 18th, 2009 at 4:25 pm
Im surprised no one has asked this already -
any time scales for when Northumberland will be online?
thanks.
March 18th, 2009 at 9:35 pm
Hmm, surely Newcastle (on Tyne) was never in the county of Durham. Newcastle & Gateshead are on opposite sides of the Tyne, which also separated the two counties, Northumberland and Durham, there.
March 19th, 2009 at 9:18 am
No, no, no. Gateshead was in Co Durham, albeit enumerated with the Northumberland Districts, but Newcastle was in Northumberland (the boundary was the River Tyne, Newcastle to the north, Gateshead to the south). If we want to get really technical, Newcastle was actually a County Borough in its own right but let’s not go there!!
March 19th, 2009 at 10:17 am
@all - thanks I have edited the post.
March 19th, 2009 at 10:51 am
But when will we have it please???
And will this effect our searches.
Do we search Durham or Northumbelrand?
Very confusing.
March 19th, 2009 at 11:02 am
What a mess.
March 19th, 2009 at 11:03 am
@pen - approximately a month and you’ll need to search under Northumberland as this is the county it was collected under.
Unfortunately we can only guess at Edwardian bureaucrats and their decisions regarding the collection of the census returns but I am sure there must have been a valid reason for their decision at the time…
March 19th, 2009 at 1:43 pm
I think you will find that a similar problem affects the whole Forest of Dean area of Gloucestershire. Despite being in Glos it is I belive included in Monmouthshire. Probably because that is the registration district for the area. I think it was the same on 1901.
Any idea when Monmouthshire will be available?
March 19th, 2009 at 2:19 pm
when will northumberland and cumberland be available?
March 19th, 2009 at 2:30 pm
Gord B - Yes, in those days (until 1974 in fact) Newcastle was - fairly uniquely - both a City and a County in its own right (its title was “The City and County of Newcastle upon Tyne”) whereas since 1974 it has just been “The City of Newcastle upon Tyne”. Prior to 1974, for ‘Census’ purposes though, it was declared under Northumberland (with both being North of the river).
I was not aware (until now) that the Gateshead area of County Durham was ever included for Census purposes (only) within Northumberland. You ‘live and learn’ don’t you . . .
March 19th, 2009 at 3:44 pm
Whatever the 1911 bureaucrats’ reason for enumerating Gateshead in Northumberland, it is to be hoped that searches will be able to find people and places there by looking at Co Durham.
March 19th, 2009 at 3:46 pm
By the way, the available counties map needs updating.
March 20th, 2009 at 10:07 am
I am searching for the Brown family in I’anson Street, Darlington. They do not appear - I thought maybe Granddad hadn’t bothered to fill in the census - would have been unusual because he filled in every one up to 1901. I have tried doing a search for I’anson Street, nothing and they were not the only house in the street. Anyone got any ideas?
I have emailed 1911 contact us but so far no response
Pat
March 20th, 2009 at 11:53 am
“Gateshead is in the county of Durham in 1911″. Hey, guess what? It still is! Local authority boundaries may have changed (they change all the time), but counties are cultural entities, independent of local government.
March 21st, 2009 at 6:28 am
Re I’anson Street, Darlington: There are lots of entries for Janson Street, Darlington - could this be the one, Pat? Mind, you’re probably safer finding your grandfather through his name, birthplace, birth year etc because house numbers can be changed over the years.
Good luck!
Liz
March 21st, 2009 at 10:25 am
At last Durham County online. Spent ages looking for people living in Gateshead without success. By chance decided to look at the blog and discovered Gateshead is included in Northumberland records. A note somewhere on the site giving this information would have helped and saved me time looking for information that wasn’t there!
March 23rd, 2009 at 7:14 pm
Carmarthenshrie next please!
March 23rd, 2009 at 7:22 pm
Can you clarify if this also means places such as Ryton, Stella, Blaydon, High Spen etc. As far as I can tell there are no results turning up for any of these places.,In 1901 Blaydon and Stella were part of Chester Le Street Borough WRT to the census, and were always part of Co Durham until 1974 when Tyne and Wear was formed. I’ve already wasted 50 credits on false returns from the Chester le Street area in desperation of finding ancestors I knew to be living in Blaydon and Stella at that time.
March 23rd, 2009 at 7:44 pm
Does this also include places such as Blaydon, Stella, Ryton, High Spen etc? These were all in Co Durham up until 1974. In 1901 Stella and Blaydon were for example in Chester Le Street division, and I’ve already wasted 50 credits on false results for people who turned up in a Durham search. I’ve now checked out some place searches for streets that have been existence for over 100 years within these towns/villages and nothing has been returned, so I’m pretty sure that these are not included within the Durham records also.
March 25th, 2009 at 5:38 pm
It is a disgrace the way the North East of England has been left to last to be on the 1911 census, even then they cant get it right, does the world revolve around the south of the country
March 26th, 2009 at 10:40 am
Do we have a date yet for when the Nortumberland census records will be available online?
Thank you
Lousie
March 26th, 2009 at 7:57 pm
Typical - we in the North East are always neglected. But we are still the best and we jolly well know it!
March 27th, 2009 at 12:26 am
@ Ann: Actually, Wales has not been released yet, so the North East of England is nowhere near last!
March 27th, 2009 at 3:07 pm
Thanks for all your great work, I wait in eager anticipation for the welsh counties. But could you please update the map, as that helps as well.
March 28th, 2009 at 10:52 am
WHAT A COMPLETE SHAMBLES THIS 1911 CENSUS RELEASE HAS BEEN
March 29th, 2009 at 10:47 am
You are right Graeme. I can well imagine a bunch of snotty, Oxbridge civil servants, back in 1911, sitting in their Whitehall rooms ( heated by coals from Durham and Northumberland ) neither knowing or caring where the North east was. How times HAVEN’T changed! It’s preposterous enough that we can’t automtically have access to this public information without having to wait for to be delivered piecemeal. The shambles goes on.
March 29th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
Will Northumberland be ready next week?
March 29th, 2009 at 9:38 pm
Ian, do you know if the next release will be just Northumberland or all the remaining English counties?
Are you still on track? I think you were aiming for the week after Easter.
Thanks for all the work the team are doing.
C.
March 30th, 2009 at 7:36 am
christ - i thought scousers were supposed to be the whiners but you chippy lot take the biscuit. its 2 years early, so take a chill pill and get over it.
March 30th, 2009 at 8:24 am
Agree with Andy, it’s 2 years early! Can wait a few more weeks. And what’s this north south thing? I live on the south coast and am really looking forward to trying to pin down my great grandfather in Jarrow. His son came south, doesn’t make us bad eggs.
March 30th, 2009 at 9:53 am
@ all: the loading of the final 3 english counties (including the rogue Durham records that wrongly ended up in Northumberland) is going well and we anticipate that they will be online a couple of days before the easter weekend.
@Keith: Blaydon, Stella, Ryton, High Spen are likely to be in the Durham pieces that were mistakenly categorised as Northumberland in the National Archives data catalogue - they will be loaded with the Northumberland data but be searchable under Durham.
March 30th, 2009 at 7:44 pm
Once again the pundits have got things wrong.
It may interest folks to know that in the 1841 census Berwick upon Tweed, which we all know from this part of the world is on the borders of Northumberland and Scotland was part of County Durham and this goes back to the Prince Bishops and Church lore.
It does NOT excuse putting Gateshead in COUNTY DURHAM albeit on TYNESIDE into Northumberland, but may explain the dilemas of yesteryear.
I agree that the powers that be are doing a grand job, but it would have been much easier to let folk know what was happenning so that time and effort was not wqsted.
The logical thing now is to ask WHEN WILL NORTHUMBERLAND BE COMPLETED or are we to await till the A1 is dualled to Scotland????
March 31st, 2009 at 9:45 am
One thing I’ll say about the “gradual” getting of the areas of the UK that I am looking for (IE, those that were NOT amongst the ones originally released) is that the wait and the expectation is . . EXCITING . . . if you see what I mean!!
I was very upset that Northern England was not included when the rest of England was released (we are discriminated against in so many walks of life, where the decision makers that affect us are based in another part of the UK) . . . and here was YET ANOTHER one! . . . BUT, we are getting this (almost childlike) “excitement and anticipation” as each extra days wait occurs.
Seriously, it’s good fun (to me, anyway!) and ‘one day’ we will wake up - and there will be . . . NORTHUMBERLAND, and the fabulous City of Newcastle . . .
March 31st, 2009 at 10:02 am
@Peter and James: it’ll certainly be quicker than the A1 dualling
Best estimate currently is that it should be available before Easter.
March 31st, 2009 at 1:01 pm
Ian, you’re right about the A1 dualling . . . ! You and I will never live to see that! Hopefully, our descendents - while they are looking with interest at the 2011 Census - MIGHT!
April 1st, 2009 at 8:45 am
I hope northumberland comes out soon my genes reunited account is gonna run out the 23rd of this month :(. So if i find anything on my ggrandma i wont be able to trace back
April 1st, 2009 at 9:47 am
New blog thread
Could the webmaster please provide two links on each blog page, 1 to the home page 2 sign off. This would save time and server traffic
April 1st, 2009 at 12:29 pm
Come on guys lets get a grip.
Almost all my husband’s relatives are in Gateshead or Newcastle so I am affected by this.
But we are getting it early - and they are also scanning left to right where at the far left was London and at the far right was the Isle of Man (or maybe Jersey)
For people who have relatives in Scotland they will have to wait until 2011 (they have a strict 100 year rule in Scotland).
Also for Ireland it is very slow - Dublin 1911 was put up in Dec 2007 and I am still waiting for the rest of the country to get there so I can do my family tree. Also BMD’s for England and Wales are online - you have to visit Dublin to get the indexes for Ireland.
Looking forward to a happy weekend over Easter - Although I might just have a look to see what I can find and wait until I can use my findmypast subscription to actually view the records
April 1st, 2009 at 1:52 pm
I am with the two Andy’s it’s two years early stop beefing and enjoy. I have to wait for the welsh counties, and to be sure the ones I want won’t be the first ones available. What is a week or two. As I understand it, it will be early summer before I can check on my ancesters, so think yourselves lucky, and chill!
April 1st, 2009 at 10:07 pm
@ Fiona: you can look for some of the Irish BMDs on the familysearch website, meaning you don’t have to go to Belfast/Dublin. I have, and also applied for some certificates, which have come relatively quickly and easily.
April 3rd, 2009 at 7:22 am
Come on with the northumberland data already!! And the rest of them. Please lets have an actual date. I’m fed up with the disappointment……
April 3rd, 2009 at 8:01 am
@Simon Mack - sorry that you’re disappointed! We’ve said several times on the blog that we are not publishing exact release dates per county as they’re a constantly moving target and this remains our policy.
We don’t believe in rushing to hit specific dates at the expense of quality, so we can’t and won’t release new counties until we are sure that they are of release quality. Please bear with us and rest assured that as new data comes online you’ll hear about it here first.
April 5th, 2009 at 7:26 am
I am really happy that the census is here for us two years in advance. I am however, very disappointed that I have just wasted a load of credits looking for relatives I know lived in Gateshead only to find out that they have been miss-filed under Northumberland. I understand also that it is not the fault of the people on 1911census.co.uk,
BUT…
IF I HAD SEEN A NOTE ON THE WEBSITE ABOUT THIS, I WOULD NOT HAVE WASTED MY MONEY NEEDLESSLY!
I wonder how many people have wasted a lot of credits looking at dead ends before coming across this thread?
Will there be some compensation?
April 5th, 2009 at 5:30 pm
Hi Ian, any update on how the data is coming along, pretty please? C.
April 6th, 2009 at 8:53 am
@C: it looks like we have a stable data release on our test site now which we will spend the day checking. If all goes well, we should be able to upload to live tomorrow or Wednesday.
April 6th, 2009 at 5:08 pm
Much appreciated Ian. Thank you.
April 6th, 2009 at 7:43 pm
@Doccas - I am also in the position of having wasted money searching for relatives in areas neighbouring Gateshead (see my comment March 23rd). I have already emailed them but, whilst they have noted that the census data was likely part of the missing Gateshead results, they seemed to have conveniently forgotten that I asked for a refund as well. Since my results might have shown up as part of the Chester Le Street division which is where they were in the 1901 census, I could be forgiven for having checked these entries in detail, before realising that there were actually many towns and villages missing from the Durham searches, none of which had been mentioned until I emailed them and commented in this blog.
This should have been pointed out on the actual site at the time, not tucked away in a blog posting.
I realise that the team have done a terrific job and without local knowledge could not have been in a position to pick up the communities were catalogued incorrectly, but it should not be the responsibility of their customers to pay money to verify that the data had been missed.
April 7th, 2009 at 11:54 am
Thanks to the Helpdesk, I have received my refund. It’s worth persisting.
April 17th, 2009 at 6:36 am
Things seem to have gone quiet. I realise that something somewhere must be being done. Where are the GATESHEAD records? There must be many, like me, who are awaiting the records of some 100,000+ people who lived in and around Gateshead in 1911.
April 17th, 2009 at 7:59 am
@Sendraguy: they’ve all been there since before Easter - see the more recent blog posts.
October 22nd, 2011 at 9:24 am
Cityjet…
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